Purdue's statement Tuesday morning of its "clear demonstration" of its commitment to Matt Painter and his program here, however non-specific that statement may have been, adds yet another layer of drama to the Boilermaker basketball coach's involvement with the University of Missouri.
As you've been reading here since Saturday, countless signs now have pointed to Painter leaving his alma mater for Columbia, Mo.
Purdue, though, according to sources separate from the athletic department's Tuesday morning comments, mobilized Monday night to make a play to keep Painter.
We have been told, independent of Purdue's statement, that Monday night Morgan Burke was, "doing everything he can with what he has to work with," to keep Painter.
Sources have told us Purdue's counter-offer, if that's what you'd call it, exceeds $2 million annually. His current deal guarantees him $1.3 with incentives worth up to a million more. However, as we have suggested before, the head coach's salary may not necessarily be the driving factor in Painter's interest in the Missouri job.
Assistant coaching salaries are a significant part of this issue. We can safely say that if Painter leaves, the departure of Rick Ray last year for a six-figure raise at Clemson, where he's associate head coach, will have been a watershed moment in all this.
Is it too late for Purdue to keep Painter?
Purdue undoubtedly wants him to stay, but at the same time, if it knows the ship has sailed, it could have made Tuesday morning's announcement so that it can come back and say later, "We did all we could."
That said, Purdue had no choice but to respond, practically speaking.
In this leverage game, Painter's held the higher ground, especially after Cuonzo Martin took the Tennessee job earlier this week. We can tell you also that even if this weren't going on with Missouri, there would be another high-major program courting Painter.
With Purdue set to open the renovated Mackey Arena, with seating licenses and pricier tickets to be sold, the athletic department could suffer profoundly from the loss of the momentum men's basketball has gained the past five years.
If Painter leaves, the question of who it could get to replace him would be a difficult one. The Boilermaker job would be opening weeks after most other high-major vacancies.
But Missouri officials have likely already met with Painter in Florida, and records show flights scheduled today between Jefferson City, Mo., and Orlando, where Painter is. Jefferson City is not far from Columbia. It stands to reason to suggest that's the plane Mizzou's delegation is taking to meet with Painter.
Needless to say, it will be interesting to see who's on board that return flight to the Show Me State.
We've used the term "shakedown" in reference to this possibly all being a leverage ploy on Painter's part, a theory that's become less and less credible with every day that's passed, simply because of how far this has gone.
But we know Purdue has stepped up with what would seem like a competitive offer. It's raised the stakes for Missouri, which is in a position where its only candidate, the one it's invested everything in, now has ultimate leverage.
With Purdue having made its offer and with Missouri's people probably smelling blood here, the end game has been reached.
This post was edited on 3/29 12:09 PM by Brian_GoldandBlack.com
This post was edited on 3/29 12:20 PM by Brian_GoldandBlack.com
Did your sources indicate whether Purdue would be willing to raise assistant salaries as well or was it merely an increase in Painter's salary?
Posted on 3/29 12:17 PM | IP: Logged
I wonder who the other program was that would've made a play at Painter.
I'm glad to hear that Purdue has made a legitimate offer to keep Painter. To me, I still think staying at Purdue is in play for Painter, but at this point, why not hear what Mizzou has to offer? I'm sure they already planned to meet, so Painter loses nothing by hearing their presentation.
The only thing I can fault Purdue with now is doing doing this all too late.
Posted on 3/29 12:19 PM | IP: Logged
Well Brian even if a small percentage of the behind the scenes stuff going back and forth has been true, and I think it is, clearly the university has mis-managed this for quite some time. Maybe this will be a wake up call, but I am not terribly optimistic when it comes for our university leadership to get in the 21st century when it comes to competing in the BCS arena. Sorry to say that, and it's not like we have not been pointing this out for quite some time. If this blows up, you have to wonder if heads will roll all the way up to the Board of Trustees. How embarrassing for the Purdue family.
Posted on 3/29 12:21 PM | IP: Logged
Tennessee......
Posted on 3/29 12:27 PM | IP: Logged
*
Posted on 3/29 12:34 PM | IP: Logged
Brian, Do you think that if Painter takes the Missouri job that Purdue will go after a real impact coach to replace him with? Give me some names of those who might realitically be candidates. Thanks
Posted on 3/29 12:38 PM | IP: Logged
They are the ones who primarily handcuff the AD with their financial independence criteria.
I don't know MB, never met him, so he could be an ogre, or just the guy trying to do the heavy lifting of a BOT that has no concept of what it means to be a true BCS school.
Posted on 3/29 12:38 PM | IP: Logged
Originally posted by Tony79: Well Brian even if a small percentage of the behind the scenes stuff going back and forth has been true, and I think it is, clearly the university has mis-managed this for quite some time. Maybe this will be a wake up call, but I am not terribly optimistic when it comes for our university leadership to get in the 21st century when it comes to competing in the BCS arena. Sorry to say that, and it's not like we have not been pointing this out for quite some time. If this blows up, you have to wonder if heads will roll all the way up to the Board of Trustees. How embarrassing for the Purdue family.
The current board is working hard to expand the Purdue Research Park and to that end has secured almost a billion dollars in grants, donations etc. Purdue trustees are more concerned over the Purdue brand being associated with Research, Jobs, Space Exploration and other ventures, than they are basketball and football. Not that those aren't important, but, the majority of the students and alumni really don't give a rats ass about athletics. We do, because we are on here, but never fool yourself into thinking that some Trustee is going to get kicked off because Matt Painter chose to go to Missouri. It just isn't going to happen at Purdue.
Posted on 3/29 12:40 PM | IP: Logged
Nm
Posted on 3/29 12:41 PM | IP: Logged
of the BOT. Getting the brand out there via football, basketball etc. is EXACTLY how UM and OSU rake in the dough for both their academics and their athletics.
Posted on 3/29 12:48 PM | IP: Logged
Originally posted by Heller:
Purdue trustees are more concerned over the Purdue brand being associated with Research, Jobs, Space Exploration and other ventures, than they are basketball and football. Not that those aren't important, but, the majority of the students and alumni really don't give a rats ass about athletics. We do, because we are on here, but never fool yourself into thinking that some Trustee is going to get kicked off because Matt Painter chose to go to Missouri. It just isn't going to happen at Purdue.
Very true. As sports fans, we sometimes forget how many people just do not give a $hit about sports.
Posted on 3/29 12:52 PM | IP: Logged
no matter what the offer. You would think that being from Purdue and having recruits, Robbie and so on would have some sway but apparently not so much.
Posted on 3/29 12:54 PM | IP: Logged
nm
Posted on 3/29 12:55 PM | IP: Logged
schools knew we were vulnerable and our AD is cheap. All of these schools would be going after Painter if Missou wasn't. Face it, everyone thinks that we are a mid major from a cash expenditure standpoint and know we won't do what is necessary to pay market price for an excellent coach. This is not going to change with our new coach if Painter leaves.
To me this is why it is important for Painter to stay. If he gets what he wants, he will add stability to our program and tell everyone else to piss off regarding our coach. To have everyone think they can get a Purdue guy out of PURDUE tells you something right there!
Go Boilers! Pay Matt Painter! delarno
This post was edited on 3/29 1:07 PM by delarno
Posted on 3/29 1:04 PM | IP: Logged
They discussed the boom at the university that past 5 years since thier run to the FF.....Construction projects all over, applications up...ect ect they didnt provide any concrete research data...but it is an interesting observation......on how sports can lead to more exposure for a university
Posted on 3/29 1:12 PM | IP: Logged
You know Matt Painter. Any thoughts about where he is leaning?
Posted on 3/29 1:20 PM | IP: Logged
I believe that theory was initially put in play when Doug Flutie led Boston College to so much success in football. But if you read research articles in sport economics/finance journals, almost all of them disprove that theory that success in sports leads to noticeable increases in donations to the general fund.
Posted on 3/29 1:45 PM | IP: Logged
cool, like i said no data to back it up just broad statements by sports radio guys....
Posted on 3/29 1:49 PM | IP: Logged
it also reminds me of the phrase "walking and chewing gum at the same time"...do it all for crying out loud!!! Like any other group, Purdue alums can and will donate to areas that matter to them - and there are a LOT of different areas and different alums.
Posted on 3/29 2:07 PM | IP: Logged
" the majority of the students and alumni really don't give a rats ass about athletics."
I couldn't disagree more. The majority of students and alumni don't care about sports? I must not have been friends with you. Yes not everyone is a sports fan but when you're at Purdue, sports becomes a very important part of the social fabric. My wife doesn't care for sports but she was at every breakfast club and football game. Once you graduate those sports are the main way you stay connected to your alumni base. Some of us live in various parts of the country so seeing the Boilers play is our main connection.
I don't know this but here is a hunch I guarantee (easy to do with nothing on the line) that alumni donations are up when Purdue sports are up and are down when Purdue sports are down. If there is even a remote correlation there then yes, sports become a very important direct and indirect revenue stream and the BOT know this!!
This post was edited on 3/29 2:08 PM by jlboiler34
This post was edited on 3/29 2:08 PM by jlboiler34
Posted on 3/29 2:07 PM | IP: Logged
Thought Rickey Jackson got a promotion to associate head coach? Why would that be such a big deal that he left for a promotion and a pay raise?
That is going to happen to Painter if he keeps having solid clubs-coaches will be offered promotions to Ass. Head Coach, and they will leave. That is a water-shed moment? LOL
Part of me is really starting to think Painter needs to grow up a little bit. He is not going to get every single thing he wants. Coaches will leave for promotions.
If he leaves for Missouri, the first thing he will notice is how much KS, OK, TX, OK ST have him completely out resourced and he will complain of that too.
Posted on 3/29 2:12 PM | IP: Logged
Agreed!
Posted on 3/29 2:12 PM | IP: Logged
The short answer and my feeling...Matt Painter stays at Purdue for a long time and we win a National Championship in the next 5-7 years. (write it down)
The long answer is that what Matt Painter is doing for Purdue Mens Basketball program what should have been done years ago, but Gene Keady did not get the chance or have the power at the time to do so.
I appreciate what Matt Painter is doing and feel because of this Purdue will need to step up and be a player if they want to be serious about our sports programs.
I will say i am pissed at the Nancy letter from the JPC, blame the alumni...are you kidding me....give it a rest.
Lastly i came to Purdue for my academics and then fell in love with the rest of Purdue including our athletics.
I cherish my degree more than anything (see Purdue truck photo's and i am 40 years old), except for my wife and parents...but I struggle to understand why we always come up short (I am a CUBS Fan as well so used to it)....Matt Painter knows first hand why and he is taking his power to insure the future is very bright at Purdue with or without him (he iscalling a spade a spade and wants action) and that the University gets a reality check to step up or he is stepping out.
Again, i think he stays...but either way this will be a historical date of events that change Purdue Athletics for a long time.....
If he leaves...willbe for the worse for awhile but at least then the University will have learned there lesson and will need to really eat crow and make amends with the alumni and rebuild the program all over again.
If he stays (which again i think he will), then the writing is on the wall and the goal is set...the pressure then switches over to Matt Painter and the program and I know Matt can handle the pressure no problem.
If you think about it this is a win win even though we have to live thru the drama until we get the final outcome....
Go Boilers!
Posted on 3/29 2:31 PM | IP: Logged
All of us on here WERE and ARE sports fans. But you're ignoring all of the people who weren't and aren't. Odds are most of us didn't spend a lot of time with them. You are speaking to your experience and you're ignoring that yours may not be the experience for most Purdue graduates.
If sports are such a priority for our almuni and students, then why are only 9,000 people members of John Purdue club out of an alumni base of hundreds of thousands? Keep in mind you can be a member for $200/year.
This post was edited on 3/29 2:34 PM by tmsf00
Posted on 3/29 2:33 PM | IP: Logged
PU52Chevy nailed it. The interest in Mizz is MP's biggest gift to Purdue. I believe it is tearing him up to do this. I also believe he'll leave if Purdue doesn't step up. But he wants to stay and he wants the ath dept to function like a champion. I hope this forces their hand.
There is nothing about the Mizz job that is better to Painter other than the way the ath dept handles BB (pay, stadium, asst coaches, etc). Withering conference, recruiting handicap and subpar fanbase. MP is a god at PU.
This will work out assuming Burke and Cordova stepped up.
By the way, I'm not sure I'd give more if they went to a FF but I'd give less if they mess this up.
Posted on 3/29 2:47 PM | IP: Logged
I thought the JPC email was out of line as well.
THe one thing that is glaring is that the Purdue alumni base is not the "all about sports" base that you see at O$U, Alabama, Texas, Michigan and many of the BCS schools. Purdue's commitment to athletics is only slightly above a mid-major program, and in some cases seemingly less.
Coach Keady complained for years about Purdue's commitment to facilities and our inability to product the "wow factor" with visiting high school students. It hasnt gotten better, but only worse now that we are in the age of marketing and internet.
Posted on 3/29 2:50 PM | IP: Logged
Originally posted by BoilerT: it also reminds me of the phrase "walking and chewing gum at the same time"...do it all for crying out loud!!! Like any other group, Purdue alums can and will donate to areas that matter to them - and there are a LOT of different areas and different alums.
If you read my response carefully you'll notice I was responding to the idea that some BoT member or members would be ousted if Matt Painter leaves. I'm a huge sports fan, but I also know that there are many who don't care and they do donate. As was pointed out by another poster, the JPC club members represent a very small fraction of the total alumni base. Sports are not where Purdue is putting their brand. That may be a mistake, although I don't think so no matter how much I want national championships, but so far Purdue's ranking among Public Universities and Corporate Recruiters continues to climb. And at the end of the day, feeding your children is a heck of a lot more important to most alums, than if Purdue makes a final four.
Posted on 3/29 2:59 PM | IP: Logged
I agree with all that you say from Painter doing what should have been done years ago (but as you say Keady did not have the right opportunity), to being pissed about the JPC letter.
Posted on 3/29 3:15 PM | IP: Logged
I have to agree with Heller here. I work with five PU eng. grads. Talked to them and four do not care about sports at all at Purdue and the other one is into sports. They range from 28 to 51 and none are JPC members or give back to Purdue (not judging them, just repeating). They do not care what Painter does.
Posted on 3/29 3:24 PM | IP: Logged
What is sad about all of this is where it puts Purdue in people's minds. I would have thought that a job at TN would be much higher caliber than MO. Martin gets that after being head coach at Podunk U, our coach goes to Podunk State? What a joke. In their conference their are several schools better like TX, OK, KS, KSU.
By the way, why did their coach leave to go to Arkansas, shouldn't that be question enough for Painter as that is not really a big step up either.
While I am realistic and realize money has to be a factor here and that Purdue has never been a world beater when it comes to paying market, but if we really did go over $2M then I don't see how he can go, also it seems like your employer should get the last shot, especially the school you went to, the one that gave you a stage.
If this is really about assistants salaries, then Painter should offer to give up some of what Purdue is willing to give him for the good of the team. I personally think he has been a little disingenuous based on what has transpired publicly.
I am sure we dont know the whole story and never will. But either way damage has been done.
Posted on 3/29 3:36 PM | IP: Logged
He had been an assistant coach at Arkansas for 17 years, so it was returning to place that he had enjoyed. It would not be right to consider Arkansas as a school with no basketball tradition. Arkansas has been in the Final Four 3 times and, being a National Champion and a second place finisher much more recently than Purdue's last Final Four appearance, so Anderson's leaving Missouri need not be considered a knock on Missouri.
This post was edited on 3/29 3:49 PM by oldgoldandblack
Posted on 3/29 3:49 PM | IP: Logged
I hope you are right pu52.
Posted on 3/29 3:49 PM | IP: Logged
Norm Stewart was a top-notch coach there for many years and the rivalry with KU was big in the days of the Big 8. He coached there for 20+ years and was as important to them as Keady was to us. He produced a number of AAs and NBA players. So while we don't think much of their recent history, they are not a Northwestern, Penn State, Minny or whatever. They would be considered an upper division team, whether in the Big 8, Big 12 or Big 10. That said, I still think the Purdue job is a better one in terms of being in a hot bed of talent, fan interest and legacy. But let's not look down our noses at Mizzou. KU can do that and for good reason - hell, their first coach was a guy named Naismith!
Posted on 3/29 3:57 PM | IP: Logged
Get real! We're not Standford or Northwestern. We have plenty of alums interested in football and basketball and they all give more to the university, as a whole, when we do well in football and basketball. If this BOT survives this debacle, it will be because we let them survive. Any person or board that could screw this up so bad is probably also screwing up everything else it touches!
Posted on 3/29 3:58 PM | IP: Logged
PU52, Agree completely with your take. Matt is going to take the step that needs to be taken even if he ends up leaving. To that I say Thank you Coach Painter for eventually getting Purdue to break through the ceiling that has been put over this program!
Posted on 3/29 3:58 PM | IP: Logged
What you say is very true, jfv2000. In addition to the Norm Stewart years, they have had successful years more recently, too. They have been to the Elite 8 twice since the last time Purdue did it. Under both Quinn Snyder and Mike Anderson. They have a 15,000+ seat arena with great atmosphere. While my bias makes me believe that Purdue is better, Missouri has a history and a commitment to facilities and salaries for it program. It is not like Painter is looking at Slippery Rock. Let's hope that Purdue has but enough more on the table to put an end ot this.
This post was edited on 3/29 4:23 PM by oldgoldandblack
Posted on 3/29 4:22 PM | IP: Logged
Remember that UT is likely to be hit with sanctions. They probably don't want to pay mega bucks for something that can't pay off for several years anyway.
Posted on 3/29 4:29 PM | IP: Logged
I hardly ever see Mizzou on National TV sdg
Posted on 3/29 4:35 PM | IP: Logged
As a 1986 grad of Purdue the whole environment has changed at Purdue. The athletic facilities have almost all been upgraded(Ross-Ade renovation, Birck Boilermaker Golf Complex, Soccer Complex, now a new baseball stadium,along with the Mackey renovation gives us the facilities to compete on a national stage. No will never have 100,000 seat stadium full to the gills which allows those schools to reinvest that money back into salaries and bonuses for coaches. I worked for the athletic dept in the middle 90's and they pay was below what I was worth but the benefits where outstanding. In those days Purdue was about 10 years behind the curve as far as compensation and facilities. This IMHO is all about security and pay for his assts. I have nothing against Ricky Ray for taking a better paying job at Clemson, he earned that right just as I was not upset when Cuonzo left for head job at MO St. I think the instablity that is being shown by the administration is atrocious and the JPC while separate from the university has basis for its letter that it sent out. Maybe its time for some fresh blood in the admin part who recognize the importance of being competitive financially. The days of underpaying coaches and expecting them to stay has flown bye-bye, with revenue generated by BTN we should be able to be competitive financially. I think Purdues athletic program is operated more like business than other institutions run theirs ie IU. Winning doesnt always coincide with outside donations but it sure helps.In the short term it hurts nationally but in the long term it shows that we will step when put in the corner. I believe Matt will stay because he knows what it takes to take us to the next level and if the reports are true about the compensation with all things being equal he will bleed Boiler blood instead of Tiger blood. Boiler UP!!!
Posted on 3/29 6:12 PM | IP: Logged
ditto this
Posted on 3/29 6:22 PM | IP: Logged
You are right. We are not Stanford or Northwestern.........we just pay like them.
Posted on 3/29 7:05 PM | IP: Logged
Is he staying or going?
Posted on 3/29 7:19 PM | IP: Logged
This is not a Purdue only thing. Think about it, most Big 10 schools are 30,000+ - most have student sections around 10-15,000. So at max, only half the students are going to football games (and how many of those truly care about the game/team?). For men's basketball, it's significantly less.
Of all the Big 10 schools, 8 of them have less than 10,000 donors. Purdue has 8,000 as of late last year. That's more than 6 other Big 10 schools (including Illinois and Michigan State). Purdue's issue is the amount of money those donors are generating (Purdue is towards the bottom), but Purdue has similar dollar amount to Minnesota, IU and Illinois. Those schools certainly are not paying their coaches on the cheap.
Posted on 3/29 7:20 PM | IP: Logged
All I'm saying is there are a lot more fish out there to reel in for JPC. They have done a poor job of identifying the ones that will donate. I am not aruguing against your point that there are many alums that don't care about sports. What I am saying is there are still a bunch of alums that do - and they are not all being contacted and asked to contribute. There are many ways to find out who those folks are.
Posted on 3/29 7:26 PM | IP: Logged
You said it all and you are right on! It should never come to an AD running around at the 12 hr trying to keep one of the top coaches in country. It should have been settled a year ago. To lock Matt up for a long long time. You don't think Matt has asked time and time again for better pay and perks for his assistance. As A CEO of a company if your right hand or top performer was not happy with something would you listen and find a way to make things happen to keep him happy! Things will never change! Purdue Athletic Dept. in the last 30 years has spent more money on non Revenue sports than they have on their 2nd biggest revenue sport until this latest expansion. We are always playing catch up in every aspect to the other top programs in the country. You give Matt Painter the tools to work with and he can make things happen. It should of been done years ago when Coach Keady was there.
Posted on 3/29 8:34 PM | IP: Logged
That says it all. This isn't about Burke. He's just a mouthpiece. It's the administration that needs to be called out.
Wake up.
Posted on 3/29 9:03 PM | IP: Logged
Hey Dummy
Painter is an impact coach, do you ever watch basketball on TV? Or do you want a crook like the Kentucky or Ohio St. coach.?
Posted on 3/29 9:57 PM | IP: Logged
yoda,,
this must be you, how about it,
pay the man what he is worth. one of the best deserves the best $$$
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